By Anais Wong
How did you find India?
Very exciting. I'm eager to go back. It's fascinating, magical, and depressing at the same time.
Why do you say "depressing"?
The vast poverty… It's upsetting. I've been to India before, in 2004, and have seen a lot of poverty in other countries too, like Tanzania, South Africa, and Brazil, but it's still very difficult to see. Very hard living conditions... You see a lot of suffering. You feel a lot of guilt.
What is magical about it?
The warmth of the people. There is just something about people there. I mean, India is so vibrant with life. Fabrics are so colorful. There's always so much going on. Very busy, a lot of energy. A lot of chaos too, with the crazy driving and all the cars… But there is also something very exciting about it all!
How did you experience interacting with people?
It was striking how different it was from here. People's response to me was different. There, I was a minority ethnically. But I wasn't "a gay guy". I mean, they didn't have a clue. It was very weird for me to not be perceived as a sexual minority like here. I could have conversations with people, I could flirt with people, no one ever knew. It was frustrating at times, because everyone just assumed I was married (to Juliana). At other times, Juliana and I had fun playing around pretending we were married. Homosexuality there is not talked about. There is movement toward gay rights that's starting to appear, but people had absolutely no "gaydar" (laughs).
Did you talk about homosexuality with people?
Well, people often asked me if I had a girlfriend or if I was married. I would usually redirect the conversation toward them, and ask them about their life. But toward the end I started getting irritated by it, so I sometimes answered "No. I don't like girls". Most just looked confused. Two times I said that I liked boys, and they seemed fine with it. Another time, I was chatting with our tour guide and told him I liked boys. He slightly surprised but didn't seem too concerned. In fact, he promptly told me that he would help find me an Indian boyfriend. I was ready to shop for my wedding Sari! But then, he talked about Prince Mavendra Singh Gohll of Gujarat who is the first openly gay Indian prince. Our tour guide was from the same cast as the prince and he said the prince was "bringing [his] cast down". He didn't seem to realize that his comments were offensive to me. He just continued to chat and being super friendly. My opinion of him shifted after this discussion because I felt a bit conflicted. I liked him on a personal level, but I was also dismayed by his comments. I tried to attribute his beliefs to a cultural norm to try not to feel offended on a personal level.
Did you personally see anything related to the nascent gay rights movement in India?
Well, one thing I can say is that it definitely feels underground. For example, we were visiting a historical site one day, and I told a merchant that I liked boys after he asked if I had a girlfriend. He immediately reached out to shake my hand, even thought we had already been introduced, and then tickled the inside of my palm with his finger. I wasn't sure what to make of it… but it did seem like he was communicating in a secretive way that he liked men too. I asked him about the handshake and he clarified its significance in more graphic terms, meaning his interest. Another salient moment that comes to mind, thinking about gay issues in India, is when we went to a gay club in Mumbai. It was a place we found in the Lonely Planet guide. That really felt underground. You couldn't tell from the outside that it was a club. We had fun. It wasn't as sexually overt as here in the United States. It was not as clear. I mean, even straight men hold hands in the street in India, so it's hard to tell who is gay and who is straight. I thought it was the cutest thing! But it was more than just cute. If felt liberating in a way to see men walking down the street, holding hands without any concern about how they are perceived and whether or not their safety was in any danger. That night at the club was certainly an adventure I won't forget! (grins)
Were there certain things you observed that you thought were relevant clinically?
Well, in India there is a more misogynistic view of women. I thought that that would really affect therapy, especially couples therapy. I think that for couples therapy to be most effective, they should move toward equality in treatment in terms of gender. This may or may not be a possibility in India at the moment, so therapists there need to be very mindful of the inherent differences between men and women when treating couples. Younger people seem more open, comfortable and sometimes even eager to talk about sex and couples issues. I wonder if that's a product of Western influence or a more generational shift that's happening…
What was the most memorable part of your trip?
We went to this women's clinic one day, and they were all high dysfunction clients. Most women spoke Tamil, but there was this one woman who spoke only Hindi I had noticed that she would walk up to the other male students and would want to hold their hand. The guys seemed uncomfortable. After a while, she came to me and wanted to hold my hand. At first it was a little strange but then I felt perfectly at ease. We held hands for a long time and she spoke to me in Tamil. We walked around the premises holding hands. I couldn't understand anything she was saying and she couldn't understand me, but I conveyed my interest and warmth with a soft tone while consistently making eye contact and smiling. We shared a very warm and special moment during that walk. It is possible that there was a bit of a "show effect" for when we came. Perhaps the women were wearing their cleanest clothes and were told to be on their best behavior or something like that, but either way, that women's clinic was a phenomenal accomplishment when one considers the broader state of mental health services in India, especially in more rural areas.
By Anais Wong
How did you find India?
For me, there were definitely two separate experiences: when Mac and I were traveling on our own, and then when we were with the group [of students from Alliant]. With Mac, people always thought that we were a couple. And they would always address Mac, instead of me. Sometimes, people would even talk to Mac about me when I was right next to him. At hotels, if I asked for anything, like a towel, they would simply not bring it. But when Mac asked for a towel, it would be here in five minutes. I also wasn't served alcohol when I asked for it. I asked for a beer once, and the bartender said "But don't you want some tea?" And then I said, "No, I want beer", to which he replied, "but beer contains alcohol". Getting what I wanted was such a struggle. And then, I had some really good experiences with the group. We were placed into rural homes with families and we slept as the families did: on concrete floor with a blanket. It was a very interesting experience… Food is a big part of the culture. It's disrespectful not to eat food that's being offered to you. So we definitely ate a lot during our trip and gained some weight (laughs). We also had a fun time figuring out Indian toilets (laughs). I had to carry toilet paper in my purse at all times. We learned about Indian traffic pretty fast. I kept looking the wrong way. Also, in India, traffic rules seem like suggestions. But, you know, you just need to be careful. Business is also conducted very differently in India. Once, we waited an hour for food, and the waiter just kept saying "don't worry, it's coming". The attitude is kind of like "everything will work itself out". I definitely learned about time there. For me, it was a valuable lesson about different cultures. It's not that it's bad service, this is just how people do things here.
How did you experience interacting with people?
Well, sometimes it was kind of challenging. For example, one of our tour guides was a very traditional Indian man. He was in his late 20's. He told us a great deal about his personal life. He said that when he walks with his wife, he expects her to walk behind him. He also has three girlfriends on the side, and his wife knows about it. But he said that he would kill his wife if she has a boyfriend on the side. He also talked openly against gays and lesbians, several times making derogatory jokes. I tried to see it clinically. I want to be open to different belief systems.
When I talked to Indian women, they really stressed how important it is to be a mother. They say that it is difficult for them to balance all their duties, between cleaning, cooking taking care of the children, and for some of them, having a job. In a traditional Indian marriage, emotional support is not expected or required, and they say that they sometimes feel lonely.
What were some of the things that struck you?
I've travelled a lot, but that was the most poverty I've ever seen. People were going to the bathroom on the floor… There was lots of homelessness, and a lot of children without clothes. So many people were extremely thin from lack of food. One day we went to a "Gypsy village". The village looked like a landfill. There were kids walking bare foot on glass, metal. Yeah… our professor told us that their main source of food was rats and cats. They dried the entrails up before eating them. We were told it's a bit like beef jerky. Hygiene was non-existent. Kids were brushing their teeth from a bucket that was right underneath where the cat entrails were hung to dry. We had brought candy for the kids and Mac got "swarmed" by the village people. Yeah, I guess they never get to eat candy, you know? In retrospect, I didn't really like that. That put us in a position of power. I realized that when you're poor in the United States, you still have a lot more than in other countries.
Were there certain things you observed that you thought were relevant clinically?
We visited the Madras School of Social Work to attend lectures and talk with the students. The role of the therapist is totally different. They see the therapist as an authority figure. It's more about giving advice. And the focus is on the family. Even when they do couples therapy, it would be the couple, the guy's parents, the girl's parents, and maybe a few other family members. They want the therapist to be an expert, like the medical model. Just tell me what to do.
We also went to a mental health center. Clinicians had several degrees. Many had MDs and PhDs in psychology. They were all very educated. They organized an outreach to small villages. When people have mental disorders in these areas, no one knows what's going on. So they take the person to the witch doctor or tribal healer, who often takes most or all of the family's belongings as payment, then performs an "exorcism" on the person who's not well. The clinicians at this mental health center developed a play that they perform themselves to show the villagers what mental health care is. I was very impressed by the way they relayed the information to the villagers. Some other things weren't so positive about the center. There was a lot of overmedication. In another center that was affiliated to the one we visited, people were chained to beds and overmedicated. But I liked that patients were given duties, like making crafts and selling them. It gave purpose to the patients.
What can you say about homosexuality in India?
Well, it was interesting to see Mac openly flirt with men and them misinterpret it. In India, [straight] men hold each other's hands, and hold each other by the waist. On the other hand, there was no affection between men and women. We even went to a "gay club" too! The club was very "underground." It seemed like many men in the club separated having sex with another man from identifying as gay. The other thing that I observed is that, for Indian people, it's so important to have children even if you're gay or lesbian. Having children is the most important thing. You can have extramarital relationships [with someone of the same sex] but you don't talk about. There were also these two gay guys who paired up with this a lesbian couple so that they can have children.
What was the most memorable part of your trip?
We went to a small isolated village. The children asked each of us "Where are you from?" and didn't understand when we all answered that we were from the United States, because we all looked so different. I could see their eyes going from me, to Mac, a White man, to an Asian girl who was part of our group (laughs). They were amazed by the diversity in the group. They liked to touch my hair because it's curly and they've never seen hair like that. That really reminded me that we have incredible diversity in the United States, and that we tend to forget its richness.
Another time, we visited a Muslim orphanage. We were allowed to go to the prayer room. They taught us what to do and how to pray. That was very powerful for me.
Is there anything that you would like to add?
It really helped to be travelling with someone as great as Mac. We did a lot of processing together, and we were able to laugh about a lot of things. He also took care of me when I got food poisoning! He really made the trip a whole lot more fun.